Intro (00:19):

Angus at Work, a podcast for the profit-minded cattleman. Brought to you by the Angus Beef Bulletin, we have news and information on health, nutrition, marketing, genetics and management. So let’s get to work, shall we?

Host (00:28):

I don't know about you, but in my neck of the woods, September is a month where the air is filled with the sound of cattle being weaned. For calves, this is a completely new experience, similar to a child's first day of kindergarten. For our cows, we're asking them to wean a calf while still caring for another baby in utero.

Sounds real easy, right? While there is a little social discomfort associated with weaning (and calves aren't afraid to let you know about it), there are also a number of methods deployed by cattlemen across the country to help their calves and cows come through weaning successfully.  On this episode of Angus at Work, we welcome you to listen in as we visit with Ted Perry with Purina Animal Nutrition regarding the stressors both cows and calves go through at weaning, how we can alter our management to address stress, the role nutrition plays, and how you can implement a few strategies to set your cattle up for improved performance long past weaning. So, let's dive in!

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Host (02:01):

Welcome to Angus at Work! I'm your host Lynsey McAnally and today we're going to be discussing a topic our audience is very familiar with: weaning. There are so many thoughts and ideas that play into planning for weaning success for both cows and calves, Ted, but before we jump in, would you mind sharing a little bit about your background and your role at Purina?

Ted Perry (02:19):

Sure, Lynsey. My role is the director of technical services for beef cattle here at Purina. I get the opportunity to have the best job in the world. I literally get to go all over the country working with producers on issues, items they may need. Pretty much anything to deal with Purina Beef Cattle, my team deals with it. We get to go all over the country working with producers on a daily basis.

Host (02:48):

That does sound like a dream job! We were talking a little bit before we started recording about how — here in my area — weaning is kind of at its height right now. And so I just wanted to ask you, would it be fair to say that weaning is one of the most stressful events that cows and calves experience? 

Ted Perry (03:05):

Oh, sure. And I don't know, sometimes I'm not sure who [it] is more stressful for. The cow or the calf. Generally I think the end result [is that it's] probably more stressful for the calf. If you think about it, what’s going through that calf is up until now, he’s basically been with mom and he’s drinking milkshakes and eating grass and doing whatever they want. Then — all of a sudden — we go through the weaning process and that calf may or may not be sure where food is. Mom’s gone. So they’ve got to reestablish the pecking order. 

One of the things that we tend not to think about is when the calf is with the cow, the pecking order [revolves around mom's] status in the herd. So if my mom's the boss cow, then guess what? I get to be the boss calf. When we wean, mom's gone. So now we have to reestablish that whole pecking order, which is extremely stressful on the calves. Then we add in everything else that's going on. We need to take as many steps as we can to reduce that stress in that calf to get them over that stressful period, absolutely as quickly as possible.

Host (04:11):

So with all of that said, what can we be doing to set that calf up to better handle weaning-related stress?

Ted Perry (04:18):

I tend to think of a lot of stuff from a nutritionist standpoint. We need to make sure that calf has all the building blocks already in its system to make sure that it can get through the weaning stress [and that] the immune system is functioning at a maximum level. We’re learning more all the time, but one of the things that is really important for the immune system of that calf is Mom’s programming.

If you look at the fetal programming, that data that’s out there is if we feed mom really well, that calf is developed to the best of its ability and therefore when it’s born, it’s as healthy and as heavy and active and [has as] robust an immune system as it can get.

Actually — I hate to say it — if you go back in time, there were times when we were trying to see how much we could reduce feeding cows to try to reduce calf birth weight. And what we found was we were getting calves born that were weak and mama was weak and her colostrum quality was bad. We've kind of gone 180 degrees there, and now we’re feeding the cow so that she can feed the calf in utero and then she has maximum colostrum. That calf’s immune system works best so that he can accept all of that colostrum to get his health off to the best of its ability.

Host (05:45):

I don't think there's any better view than when you have a cow lay down and have a calf and that calf bounces up and has so much vitality. There's something special about that.

Ted Perry (05:55):

There is! The thing that we’ve learned with the body condition scoring and with the fetal programming is that calf in 30 minutes, they’re up and nursing. The calves that are weaker, they may go an hour to an hour and a half. In the sun, in the dirt, in the dust? Then we go the other extreme: if we’re in the middle of January or February when there’s cold stresses happening, the quicker we can get that calf up, the quicker we can get that calf’s belly full of colostrum. One thing about [calves] getting a belly full of something that’s 104 degrees, that’s a nice warmer right there. But all of that getting into that calf literally comes down to feeding the cow.

As I go around the country, I hear a lot of people say, "Well, how do I know the cows are getting what they need?”

It’s body condition scores (BCS). As long as we’ve got that, we keep that cow in a body condition score around that BCS 5.5-6, we know that she’s getting all of the nutrients she needs to take care of herself, the calf on the ground and the calf in utero. We don’t need to get her to a BCS 7. She shouldn’t have to be fat, but we do need to make sure that she’s at least at BCS 6. That’s kind of the happy medium where we need her to be if we can feed her and keep her going.

As a nutritionist, my job is to make sure that the girls get what they need when they need it and just get out of their way and let Mother Nature take its toll, because Mother Nature is better at this than we are and sometimes when we try to help them, I think we’re actually hurting ourselves.

Host (07:23):

There can be a lot of truth to that. I read your bio on the website, and I chuckled to myself. I couldn’t agree with that more. Obviously, supporting our cattle and making sure that we give them what they need to be successful, but sometimes it can be really easy to get in their way. One thing that I did want to chat with you a little bit about, we’ve talked about stress at weaning. There are a number of different things [that contribute to stress], but how do you think that the method of weaning plays into the level of stress those calves are going through?

Ted Perry (07:53):

There’s lots of different methods. Fenceline weaning. We’ve got the nose guards. I’ve worked with enough producers that absolutely swear by fenceline weaning because Mom can see the baby and the baby can see Mama, but they can’t get together. And usually when you put a total program together, okay, we’ve got the fenceline weaning, maybe we’ve got the nutrition, we’ve got the lots set out, which we can spend some time talking about. 

People think in terms of weaning; they don’t think in terms of a calf. They think in terms of this is where we feed cattle. Calves are short. They need low bunks. They need low water. They need a lot of water available, but they need to make sure that everything is sized for that calf. What you’ll see a lot of times is the calves actually they start ignoring mom before she starts walking away from the baby.

From a calf standpoint, there’s been some good data over the years that shows that the stress goes down when that calf has a full belly. And as soon as he gets a full belly and the rumen is full and starts working, then the stress goes way down. Okay, Mom's not here, but I’m going to live because I’m not hungry anymore. And if you’re a calf, that’s your biggest worry, right? Am I going to get hungry? Where’s my next meal coming from? Getting the environment right and making sure that those calves have feed that they’re used to eating, that they understand how to eat, that reduces the stress.

Probably one of the worst situations and the hardest for the calf is just weaning them on the truck. Taking bawling calves to the sale barn. I can’t think of a more stressful way to wean a calf. Mom’s gone. The environment’s gone. They’ve gone through a stressful environment and then at some point in 24 to 48 hours later, they end up in a brand new environment and when they hit the new environment, of course the rumen’s completely depleted with microbes. They’ve got to restart everything and learn what the feed is and where the feed is. So I’m a big proponent to reduce stress is to wean on farm, to wean at the ranch, to give that calf 45 days so that they understand they’re completely over the stress of weaning and their systems are up and going. So when you move them the next time, it’s not really a big deal.

Host (10:04):

I’ll say this, I too am less stressed when I’ve had a good meal. So I was going to ask you, we talk about early weaning in times of drought or for other management reasons, whatever that may be. What are the implications of that for the calf and for the weaning process?

Ted Perry (10:21):

When I look at the CattleFax numbers and when I look at the size of cows, how cows have grown … I mean in the past 24 years we’ve added about 200 to 300 pounds (lb.) on the average size of the cow. The calves haven’t kept up, and if you look at it, the weaning weight of the calves it’s kind of stagnated. I wonder if we haven’t maximized the weight gain of a calf on grass and mama’s milk. So when you talk about things like creep feed, early weaning, anything where we can get additional nutrients into that calf above just the forage and milk, we’re going to increase the weight gain of that calf and it helps. When the calf is bigger [at weaning], he’s got more reserves to pull from when he gets weaned. He also knows what feed is and what a bunk is.

And I think that’s one of the reasons why the use of tubs in weaning pens has gotten so popular over the last few years. Tubs are almost ubiquitous within cattle production and the cow-calf industry. Calves know what a tub is. As you go around now and you look at herds that haven’t weaned, mom licks off the lick tub and so does the calf. They know what something is. So when they go to a weaning pen, [tubs are] familiar. I know what this is. I know what hay is. I found my water earlier. Weaning, creep feeding, all of those things to get the calf more knowledge and build his reserves for when he goes into the weaning period helps reduce the overall effects of that stress.

Host (11:50):

I think calves tend to be a lot like people when we put them in new environments. When you don't have things that are comfortable to you, you get extremely stressed out and very anxious.

Ted Perry (12:00):

One of the things, to get into your early weaning [question], once those calves are 5 months old, they can easily be weaned without a problem. Your weight gain is probably going to improve. One thing we don’t think about is for every three calves we pull off the pasture, that's one day's worth of feed for the cow, so we can greatly increase the amount of forages available to the cows to help them build body condition going into winter while the calves continue on growing. There’s lots of benefits to early weaning, and you don’t have to wait until it’s a complete drought and there’s nothing to eat out there.

Host (12:37):

What’s your recommendation for the steps to get these calves started on, and then also what do you recommend as far as preweaning vaccinations to help with some of those maybe stress-related issues?

Ted Perry (12:52):

Well, I’m going to take the cow herds way out on the vaccinations. You need to work with your local veterinarian on that. And the reason I say that is last week I was in Georgia and what they’re talking about needing to vaccinate their calves for is different than here in Missouri or when I was out West. It’s different and that’s why a good vaccination program, there’s some things you’re going to have to hit them. You’re going to need the cluster deals. You’re going to need the upper respiratories.

I encourage producers to do two things every year before weaning time. What’s our vaccine program going to be? And two, I think producers need to look over from a nutrition standpoint. We know we’re going to have to get forage into them. We know we’re going to have to get energy and protein, and we’re certainly going to need to get the minerals and trace minerals into them.

If this is a year where we are in Missouri, we have tons and tons of hay. Calf prices are good. This might be the year where you feed a 5-pound-a-day product along with free-choice hay because we’re still going to get 2.5-3 pounds of gain on those calves, and we’re using more of our homegrown resources. If we get into a drought year where there’s no hay and then we probably won't use a complete product. And I'm not a big fan of, 'We use this product all the time. We’ve used PreCon for 53 straight years.' I don’t believe that for 53 straight years, PreCon has been the best starting program for your herd based on prices, based on forage availability and what we have as a farm. Talk with your vet every year and go over with your nutritionist, what are we going to do to wean calves this year?

Host (14:39):

I love that.

Ted Perry (14:40):

The one thing that I am a big fan of, I want a nutrition program. There’s certain things I want in there. I mean, I want enough protein. I want degradable protein. I want undegradable protein. I want enough calories. I want fermentable carbohydrates, and I want to control all of that stuff. We can get way off in the weeds where we probably don’t need to get today, but the one thing that I like in every receiving pen, whether it’s the weaning pen or it’s the receiving pen if I’m buying calves, I’m a big fan of the cooked stress tubs. Because the calves know what it is. It’s a new environment, but they see the tub sitting there and when you watch the calves stop, calm down, they lick the tub. Again, we’re talking about coating the back of that throat, but in that tub, think about what’s in there.

You’ve got sugars, you’ve got protein, and then in our tubs we’ve got other direct-fed microbials and things that are really helping build rumen bugs. We’ve made some additions with the new product. There’s three things that are really helpful. We've got a new source which gives us more volatile fatty acids coming from that rumen. Volatile fatty acids are made into glucose at the liver. The other thing we haven’t talked about is when that calf is stressed, he needs more glucose so the cells start incorporating more glucose. The trace mineral chromium is needed for the glucose receptor. What happens is the calves get stressed because they need the more glucose. They can deplete their store of chromium really fast. Then we’ve got a breakdown. We don’t get the energy into the cells that are needed so that 6 pounds that they need, we’re not getting it where it needs to go. The goal is we’re going to get calves on feed, but we’re also going to get more energy into the cells to drive that glucose to the 6 pounds needed to drive that immune system.

Host (16:37):

I know you just talked about a couple of important nutrients. What are some of the common nutritional deficiencies that we typically see in weaned calves?

Ted Perry (16:48):

We probably run out of trace minerals the quickest. Chromium is the one of them, but zinc and copper also get depleted really fast, and we’re not going to build an immune system unless we have all those trace minerals.

Host (17:00):

Taking all of that into account, even in the best managed herds, we are going to run into deficiencies from time to time. Whether that be just based off of forage quality, where we’re at as far as drought, any number of things. But what are some signs that listeners can look for to determine if their cattle do need additional supplementation of some of those micronutrients?

Ted Perry (17:26):

The cows will tell you first before weaning. I need to look at the cows. If I’ve got rough hair coat … Body condition is the key, right? If my cows are thin, then they’re obviously missing nutrients. We tend to think in terms of body condition that they’re missing energy, but protein and minerals go right along with that. And then from the calf standpoint, we’ve all seen a calf. You say, okay, that calf is healthy. That calf’s sick. If you’ve ever watched a group from back, you’ll see calves that don’t look good. Their head is down, they’re starting to look sick. And you look at those calves, you walk into the calves the way they do, they perk right up. Why do they perk right up? Because I don’t want to be the sick one. That’s the one that the coyotes eat, right?

Host (18:08):

Nope, nothing wrong with me, nothing to see here.

Ted Perry (18:12):

That’s exactly right. If the cows are getting what they need, then especially later on right before weaning, the calf is eating a lot while Mom is eating and we get them a balanced diet into that rumen. Get the minerals up, especially the trace minerals. We get them up to where they need to be and then that calf can take off on the immune system on their own.

Host (18:34):

While we’re doing all of this and the focus is on the calf — the calf who is going through weaning currently — what effect is this stress potentially having on the cow and the calf in utero? What effect does a lack of certain micronutrients potentially have on that calf in utero for their future success?

Ted Perry (19:02):

Oh, a lot. I’m glad there’s someone else who thinks the fetal programming is exciting because we just did a study with North Dakota State where by just feeding half of the minerals versus not minerals, the heifers that got minerals during gestation, they produced one and a half times more colostrum. The control diet was not devoid of minerals. It had 80% of the NRC requirements. But if you think about getting one and a half times more colostrum into a calf? Those heifers that had the trace minerals, they weaned off a 36-pound heavier calf feeding that cow in utero. It affects that calf. But also cows, when they’re weaning this calf, they’re going to go through a stress process. When they have adequate nutrition, they get over the stresses easier, too. They have stores within their bodies to increase what needs to be to get over that stress, making sure the cow has the resources available that she will get through it.

But if we don’t have that available, say, we’re weaning the cow off and she’s at a BCS 4.5. Twenty years ago, we’d have talked about what a great cow that is. Look how hard she’s working. But what we know now is that cow, when she’s at a BCS 4.5, she didn’t milk to her potential. So the calf she’s weaning is smaller, and then the calf that’s in utero, that calf isn’t developing normal. That’s going to be that weak calf that doesn’t have as active an immune system when they’re born. So, body condition score on the cows. I hate to be a broken record, but it is so important because it’s something we can see and really evaluate how the diet’s doing.

Host (20:46):

Calves are the more dramatic piece of the puzzle during weaning, I would say. But cows also go through a couple of days of stress that can definitely take a toll on their intake of nutrients and how hydrated they stay, all of that. And we’re also asking them to take care of that calf that is inside of her while she’s drying up and maybe dealing with some other health-related issues. I know we talked about fetal programming, but should we pay more attention to the cow and her needs during that weaning process? Why is it critical that we consider cow stress during weaning?

Ted Perry (21:24):

You’re exactly right. To your point, during that weaning program, we need to make sure she has good mineral out there. She has plenty of forage or she has plenty of energy and protein and water. Water is a critical one because what’s she doing the whole time that she’s bawling for that calf irritating the back of that throat? So, yeah, could she catch a little bug or something with all that irritation? Sure, but she’s got this vast immune system that’ll wipe it out as long as we give her all the tools that she needs. We’ll let her take care of herself, but we’ve got to give her the building blocks to do what needs to be done.

They’re the forgotten ones. I mean, I grew up in western Illinois, and we would wean calves pretty scientific. It was basically when the crops were out, deer season was over or Thanksgiving, the cows were at Grandma’s. They would go out on cornstalks, and then we wean the calves and take them to another place out of sight, out of mind. The whole nine yards.

Then everybody worried about the calves, but nobody worried about the cows because they’re out on cornstalks. They’re fine. They’ve got a pond. We could do that with a 1,000-pound cows. We got away with it. It was fine. And I get around the country, it’s like, well, we just wean cows out on cornstalks. Maybe a hay bale and a mineral feeder or some liquid feed. You could do that then because you weren’t pushing the cows near as hard. Now we’ve got 1,400-pound cows, so you don’t have the energy out in that corn field to drive a 1,400-pound cow that would feed a 1,000-pound cow. You don’t want to wean a cow, even though we know that when we wean her, we’re cutting her nutrient requirements in half. You can still take that 1,400-pound cow on a cornstalk field and her nutrients are not met. So she’s losing weight, which is a bad thing, especially with that fetus inside her. You’re not getting her ready to go into wintertime.

Host (23:16):

Which brings up another topic altogether. What nutritional considerations do we need to keep in mind during fall and winter when it comes to helping those cows grow the healthiest calf possible?

Ted Perry (23:26):

Same thing that we just talked about. I mean all the way through 30 years ago when I started in this business, we talked about using trace minerals only prior to breeding, but now what we keep talking about is we’re pushing closer and closer to those nutrient requirement limits. We’re seeing healthier calves. Zinpro’s got some really nice data that shows that it helps those calves in utero. When we’re weaning those cows year round, I want to make sure she’s got a good mineral source.

I’m a huge fan of trace minerals. There’s still some people that don’t think they’re herds need it. That’s fine. As long as you’re getting a good solid mineral. I’m not talking about a salt block, but a good, solid bagged mineral, and then making sure that they have adequate forage and quality of forage. Watch the manure scores. The manure scores will tell you where you’re at. You just have to look. And, Good Lord, we look at them when we’re walking around the pasture just so we don’t step in it. Use that information.

Host (24:25):

Well, we’ve talked about the why of the matter, right? Extensively about the why of the matter. I have thoroughly loved this conversation, but I would like to devote a little bit of time to the how. So Purina has a number of products on the market that can assist producers with the issues that we’ve discussed. Do you mind sharing a little bit about your cow-calf-centered product line?

Ted Perry (24:48):

Sure. People make fun of me, but we literally have thousands of products. And the reason we have thousands of products and not 10 is because every place in the country is different, right? They need different products in the Carolinas than they need in the Dakotas, which are different than what we need in California and the Oregon coast. But as far as product types, when we go down South, we use a lot of liquid feeds on range cows. That’s because that’s close to the molasses source, so it’s available. We don’t have as many as we go north and west. We don’t have as much liquid because we’re farther and farther from the source, and how far can you haul something and still make it cost effective to give to a cow? But at that same time, the reason the liquids work really well is because you’ve got sugars from the molasses.

So we’re feeding the rumen bugs. We can put some minerals in there. Then we’ve got protein. So we’re feeding the rumen bugs really well. If you take what’s in those liquid feeds and then you look at our cooked tubs, you’ve got the same ingredients just in a different form. The reason it’s hard is that it sets up, but we’re still getting the protein and energy that we need to give to feed the rumen microbes so that they can get more energy out of the forages. We’ve got some data from K-State from years ago that talks about how we get 30% more energy to the cow by feeding the rumen microbes. So all of those things work.

We’ve got a lot of producers that they want to feed the cows, whether it’s because here in the Midwest we have corn and soybean meal. We have a lot of ingredients on farm that we want to use. By all means. We make lots of diets for producers and say, here’s what you need to feed your cow every day. Even if it’s a silage-based TMR (total mixed ration), there’s a billion different ways to feed cows. And every ranch has different needs. They have different feedstuffs available. Different cows. Different equipment available. That’s where you work with your local consultant or your local feed nutritionist.

Every Purina dealer has a team that can help you. Part of my day is to go out to a ranch or a farm and sit down with the producer and say, okay, what are we going to do this year? As much as I would love to tell you here, feed this and this and this, it’s not going to work everywhere. I hate to give you the answer ‘it depends,’ but it truly does. That’s why we have so many different products for so many different types of producers.

Host (27:32):

Can you talk a little bit about those stress-specific products, how they work and when they should be used?

Ted Perry (27:38):

We’ve got a cow product, a cooked tub, that is truly unique because it has rumen undegradable fat. It’s called 24-12 High Fat. But that product, what it does is it feeds the rumen bugs and maximizes the rumen and what the rumen bugs put out. Then the extra, if you will, it has 5% rumen-protected fat so that fat is inert in the rumen. It doesn’t mess with the rumen bugs or anything, and then we’re putting that fat right into the cow. So we’re getting the most calories out of the rumen bugs. We’re getting the most protein out of the rumen bugs, and then we’re getting the most calories to the cow with that product. It’s truly unique. Nothing else is like it on the market. 

So starters, like I said, we have lots of different starters. We have four distinct lines of products that we have. PreCon has been around forever. There’s a patent on PreCon. It was the first product to pellet cottonseed hulls. That’s why it’s that big old fuzzy-looking pellet. PreCon works great, don’t get me wrong. It’s just that the thing with PreCon is it was made for 1960 calves.

Cattle today, the intake is so high that you put out 10 pounds of PreCon, they inhale it in 30 seconds. It may not be the best for starting young calves. You want to feed it in two different meals. You don’t want to just throw out 10 pounds per day in the morning, because if I throw it out at 7:00 a.m., by 7:03 a.m. they’re done with their PreCon, and we’ve just blown up the rumen. So, like I said, PreCon is an excellent product. Don’t get me wrong. If I have stress calves, if I’m buying stress calves and I know they’re stress calves, I’m putting them on PreCon for five or seven days. I don't care what else is there. At my house, they’re going on PreCon.

The other two dry starters is AccuRation starter, which is designed for a self-feeder. It works great on purebred cattle where we’re trying to maximize the amount of gain we get off of them. It’s also the product of choice during a drought, because I don’t have any forages to give them, and I don’t want to waste the forages that I have on the starter calves. I’m going to save those for the cow. So I’m going to use a free-choice product that I don’t have to use up any of my homegrown resources.

The opposite of that is our Stress Care line. It’s designed to put into, I mean, we’ve got 5- and 10-pound-a-day of pellets, but we also have where we can use that in a TMR and use that as the protein pellet.

And then as you’re going through the TMR system and you get into 21 days, the calves are fine. They don’t need a starter anymore. You can just swap out the Stress Care pellet for another grower pellet and the calves don’t even know they got changed on the diet.

So that’s the three feeds. 

And the final [product] is called the Stress Tub. We are just now coming out with a brand new one, which we talked about earlier. You'll be impressed with the fancy name we have. It’s called Stress Tub 2.0. That’s what happens when you get nutritionist thinking things like that. But it is truly a different product. There’s nothing else like it on the market. We were lucky enough, we came out with the first Stress Tub and then the rest of the companies followed us. I’m fully expecting them to do the same with this one.

The difference is we’ve had kind of a new different yeast source. With that, we literally got more volatile fatty acids growing in that rumen. We grew more rumen bugs faster, got more energy out of that, and therefore we could take advantage of the chromium that we talked about earlier. And then that product is actually used in ProPath, which is Zinpro’s next latest, greatest innovation to replace Availa 4. Those are the stress products that we use. All of them are designed for what we talked about. It gets those calves on feed. Once those calves are on feed and eating, stress goes down and the rest kind of takes care of itself.

Host (31:37):

Well, what have we forgotten?

Ted Perry (31:38):

To be honest, we’ve covered so much stuff. I couldn’t tell you.

Host (31:42):

We’ve covered a lot of ground, but that’s what I like in these podcasts. It gives us the chance to do that. Right?

Ted Perry (31:47):

As you go through, it’s like, okay, we started A and then B, and now we’re back to A, and then we go to C. And we haven’t been very linear in our thought process, but .. 

Host (31:56):

It's all tied together.

Ted Perry (31:58):

I don’t want to try to overcomplicate things, but that’s kind of cattle nutrition. It’s literally all tied together.

Host (32:05):

Perfect. And there’s one final question for you, Ted. I hope you’ve done your homework. We always like to end Angus at Work on a really positive note. There’s so many things out there in the world right now in particular that are heavy. So I love to end it by asking, what is one thing happening in your life personally or professionally that you are thankful for?

Ted Perry (32:27):

That’s fairly simple. I’ve worked with the local 4-H kids for over 20 years since my kids were in 4-H. And when I see what these kids are like with their projects, and when I see what these kids are doing, I am totally comfortable that the [agriculture] industry is in good hands.

Host (32:44):

What a good way to end it. There’s so many good things to be said about youth and youth in agriculture in particular. Thanks for telling us that! And thanks so much for joining us for Angus at Work. I just said I always learn so much from these podcasts and I know that our audience is going to get so much value out of our discussion, Ted.

Ted Perry (33:07):

Good deal. Thanks for having us.

Host (33:08):

Thank you so much for joining us.

Outro (33:17):

Listeners, for more information on making Angus work for you, check out the Angus Beef Bulletin and the Angus Beef Bulletin EXTRA. You can subscribe to both publications in the show notes. If you have questions or comments, let us know at abbeditorial@angus.org and we would appreciate it if you would leave us a review on Apple Podcasts and share this episode with any other profit-minded cattlemen. Thanks for listening. This has been Angus at Work!