Lynsey McAnally (00:31):

Angus at Work, a podcast for the profit-minded cattleman. Brought to you by the Angus Beef Bulletin, we have news and information on health, nutrition, marketing, genetics and management. So let's get to work, shall we?

Weather, drought, market prices and other factors can all put a major damper on the success of cattle producers year to year. Speaking with producers across the nation recently, there are struggles to be had whether rain has come your way or not. But how can we as livestock producers build a safety net in the event of unforeseen circumstances?

I'm Lynsey McAnally and, on today's episode, we invite you to listen to a conversation from CattleCon 2025 that Angus Beef Bulletin Editor Shauna Hermel had with Charlotte Talbott, sustainability analyst on the RaboResearch Food and Agribusiness team for North America, regarding the importance of genetics related to potential herd rebuild, on-farm risk management opportunities, and why financial and succession planning ahead of time can build the buffer needed to ride out rough times.

But before we begin, we want to take a moment to thank Vermeer for their sponsorship of this episode.

Nick Jorgenson (01:34):

My name is Nick Jorgenson. I'm the CEO of Jorgenson Land & Cattle here in Ideal, South Dakota. When it comes to getting forages put up, the most important thing for us is getting it done as efficiently as possible and that's largely dictated by the equipment that you're using. So, we've really focused on looking around the industry and finding the best, most efficient equipment that we can find out there. But if you don't have equipment that's reliable and that runs well when you get it in the field and stays running, you're going to have a hard time. Vermeer products are a big reason that we can get more done in a day.

See how Vermeer helps Angus producers do more at vermeer.com/angus.

Shauna Hermel (02:14):

Hello and welcome to this edition of Angus at Work. I'm Shauna Hermel, editor of the Angus Beef Bulletin. Charlotte, could you tell us a little bit about your background and maybe how you came to Rabobank?

Charlotte Talbott (02:26):

Yeah, absolutely. So I'm originally from North Carolina. I went to NC State. My mom went to NC State as well, so I was a ...

Shauna Hermel (02:34):

The wolf pack.

Charlotte Talbott (02:35):

Yeah, exactly right. So I was a legacy and I grew up with horses. We were horse people and I always say that wasn't necessarily [agriculture], but I had always rode horses and some of my family bred horses. So I wanted to go into animal science. Ended up doing my Bachelors and my Masters at NC State related to cattle and grassland systems. I did a lot of grazing studies. The forage nerd, that's what I like to call myself. So after that, I moved out to Colorado and I was with the National Cattleman's Beef Association (NCBA) on the Checkoff side, working on the research team.

Shauna Hermel (03:20):

And what projects did you work on there?

Charlotte Talbott (03:23):

Yeah, absolutely. So I was on the sustainability research team for the Checkoff side. We were looking at anything from studies on succession planning, studies on grazing management and pasture resources. We did a lot on the impact of financial planning, looking at how grazing management plans can work into the greater sustainability picture in terms of things like climate. So we funded a lot of those types of research with various institutions and universities, land grants across the U.S.

Shauna Hermel (04:01):

Is that how you became connected with Rabobank?

Charlotte Talbott (04:03):

That is, yes. I had a friend of a friend who knew one of my colleagues that maybe some of your listeners will know: Lance Zimmerman. He talked to me a lot about this role and thought it was something I'd be interested in. Coming from the trade organization over to the private sector, I was used to working for farmers and ranchers with a trade organization, and it's really not that different.

Shauna Hermel (04:31):

Tell me a little bit about your position that you have today?

Charlotte Talbott (04:34):

Yeah, I am the Animal Agriculture Sustainability Analyst on the RaboResearch team. So RaboResearch is an independent research group that is there to provide value to our clients and stakeholders. So we look at market trends, we look at opportunities and risks that are associated in my case with the livestock sector and try to find revenue opportunities, risk management opportunities, and convey those back to our clients. For my role in sustainability, it's an ever evolving landscape. I'll say there's something new every day related to sustainability. Trying to pick through what's going to stick, what are we going to see coming, how does that impact each stage of the supply chain? So if I'm a cow-calf producer, what's the next thing I can expect that I will see regarding sustainability, so on and so forth.

Shauna Hermel (05:28):

Okay. And you mentioned clients. Describe a typical client that would come to you.

Charlotte Talbott (05:34):

Yeah, absolutely. So Rabobank is a relationship bank. We generally are targeting clients that are maybe a bit on the larger side just because of how the organization is set up. We are a global bank and we've financed the entire food and ag supply chain. That's solely what Rabobank's role is. That's the only type of clients that we finance at all. So it's pretty unique. We've been around for 125 years, or 126. Last year was the 125th anniversary. We are cooperative that was started by farmers and ranchers. So in the U.S. we finance anybody from a cow-calf producer, row crop operator to a feed yard, to specialty crops. We do a lot of wine and grape production, but all food and ag.

Shauna Hermel (06:27):

Okay. So looking at the beef industry, what opportunities are you seeing today?

Charlotte Talbott (06:32):

Yeah, absolutely. So it's pretty well known at this point that we are entering a rebuild process. We've been talking about it for a while, but I think this is kind of the year where we are going to reach some stabilization and start looking towards growth in the future. And so what that means to me is that we will be expanding the herd and there can be some strategic ways to look at that expansion period. And so a higher share of the retail dollar is down is reaching our cow -alf producers and where can they invest that in things like efficiency, operational productivity to set themselves up for the next cattle cycle, the next 10 years, and really try to mitigate some of the risks that we see coming down the line as far as weather uncertainty, market uncertainty. Really just making a resilient system.

Shauna Hermel (07:23):

I was going to ask you what exactly, how do you define sustainability?

Charlotte Talbott (07:28):

Yep, absolutely. So sustainability, the way that I view it - and the way that we talk about it at RaboResearch - is really the kind of three-legged stool approach. So combining that business longevity with profitability as well as your environmental stewardship and social aspects. So thinking about your community cohesion and having that ranch life be an integral part of the community and as well as the food supply chain. So that's how we think about it. We actually conducted a survey at RaboResearch pretty recently where we surveyed farmers and ranchers across the entire United States and asked them that question, what does sustainability mean to you?

It wasn't a surprise, but a lot of it was generational success, longevity, passing my farm down to my kids and their kids. And so when we think about the confusion that comes with sustainability, I often see that there's a disconnect between what a farmer or rancher views as sustainable and what some companies farther down the supply chain might view as sustainable. But in my world, I try to connect those. So if I am a packer or processor and I have a sustainability goal, I'm never going to be able to reach that goal unless my suppliers, cow-calf producers or feedlot operations are in business. So it all works together.

Shauna Hermel (09:00):

You bet. You mentioned that one part of the sustainability is having that transition plan in place. We know from some of our surveys that not a lot of our producers have an estate plan or have something in writing for how that [operation] will transfer. Do you all offer any assistance for how they can get that process started?

Charlotte Talbott (09:25):

Yeah, absolutely. And I'd love to connect anyone that's listening or that's interested with some of our banking team members, but we can definitely help with longer-term financial planning as well as looking toward the goals of the operation as a whole.

Shauna Hermel (09:42):

Okay. So do you have a process that you sit down with a producer to actually go through their ... maybe measure what you would consider their sustainability quota?

Charlotte Talbott (09:56):

Yeah, so that's an interesting question because then the follow-up question to that is what exactly are we measuring? So I think that we can absolutely help with, especially on that economic sustainability piece, that financial piece. We can certainly help with that. Where I come in a lot is working with producers specifically. I think there's no one size fits all for sustainability and for even just practices in general. Practices and principles on the operation. So it's a very tailored approach and talking to that individual producer and saying, Hey, what are your goals? What happened in the last 10-year cycle? And what do you want to change? What do you want to improve? Is there a specific genetic goal you'd like to tailor? Do you want to strike a better balance between your maternal and terminal traits? So those types of things are what we do or what I am really working on.

And I talk a little bit about that through my last paper, which is specifically about some unique opportunities that we have right now in this point in the cycle. And that was out in November of last year, but still really relevant because we will be approaching that rebuild period looking at the crux of expansion and where we're at right now. Like I said a little bit earlier, higher share of the retail dollar reaching that cow-calf producer. And looking at investments into the future. So the three areas that I've highlighted are improving grassland and forage resources. So we've been through quite a bit of drought over the past few years. That is what exacerbated some of the liquidation that led to the record low cattle numbers and inventory. And so while some pasture conditions are recovering in some areas, there are still many that have bare spots, have some weed encroachment, some woody encroachment, invasive species.

And so addressing those and really building up the resiliency for the next drought. And also those additional cattle that we may be retaining. If we're going to start retaining more heifers, bringing in more bred heifers, making sure those pasture resources are in tip-top shape before that next step. The second one is really around genetics. And I'm sure you guys enjoy this conversation at Angus.

Shauna Hermel (12:32):

Oh, we talk about it every day.

Charlotte Talbott (12:33):

Yep. So this is one of my favorite topics related to sustainability and outside of sustainability. I think there's a huge opportunity for looking at those cattle that we might retain or those bred heifers we might buy or those other replacement animals we're bringing in to be the absolute best genetics possible. And that they are going to, again, meet your goals, but are also going to meet the goals of your customers throughout the next cycle. So is there a way that we can attach some data or information to these cattle when they go to the sale barn utilizing things like DNA testing? I know Angus has some DNA genomic testing for commercial cattle.

Shauna Hermel (13:21):

You bet.

Charlotte Talbott (13:21):

And so looking at some predict ... indicators of predictability. What's going to happen to these cattle when I sell them. Is there value for me as a cow-calf producer and having that info. And then lastly, just quickly looking at a lot of emerging programs and technologies that are becoming more accessible to cow-calf producers, especially related to sustainability. We have seen quite a few initiatives, programs, some funding boosts to traditional NRCS programs, and I think there's a real opportunity for producers to capitalize on that because a lot of times they're providing financial assistance for fencing, for genetic testing, for kind of pasture renovation. And so I think there's sometimes money left on the table that can be utilized for that sort of thing that we kind of have a special window of opportunity for right now.

Shauna Hermel (14:27):

So do you provide, as Rabobank, some insights into maybe working with a producer on what sorts of programs might be available that would help them?

Charlotte Talbott (14:40):

Yep, absolutely. So there are quite a few of programs out there, whether they be government, so thinking USDA and NRCS programs or federal programs as well as private industry initiatives. And so we are here to help our clients more about what are you trying to achieve? Is there a specific product you'd like to buy? Do you want to try fertilizer in your pastures this year if you're in maybe one of your Southeast regions? And so we even offer input financing where we can help buy some of those inputs and connect producers with maybe some solutions there. But yeah, we absolutely will talk with some of our clients about specific practices, changes, things that they're looking to implement and absolutely find somebody that can help if it's not us.

Shauna Hermel (15:35):

Of course, as we're setting up some of those goals and looking at things, we want to set some metrics to measure, okay, how were we successful or were we successful? What type of, I guess, opportunity might producers have in visiting with you to help set those metrics so they can say, 'If I put in a new pasture management program, how do I measure whether that was successful in three years?'

Charlotte Talbott (16:05):

Yep. So one of the other things I talk a lot about is just recordkeeping systems or recordkeeping management technologies. So when you talk with, especially some of these newer companies who have created these farm management platforms, they always say, our biggest competition is the pen and paper, or our biggest competition is somebody who's got that plan in their head and they're the only one on the ranch that knows it.

I know that there is a lot of market opportunities left on the table because we're just not writing things down, we're not recording things, we're not looking at the data year to year. And so if we have that information, it can be utilized in many ways. So passing that performance or genetic information, animal health information on its sale and getting a little higher dollar for that lot potentially. There's quite a few technologies that are available now, whether you have your newer technology companies as well as some older. I shouldn't say older, but some of your more traditional farm management-type platforms. We really encourage utilization of those because, again, everyone always says you can't manage what you don't measure, and there's a million different things you can measure on the ranch. Are you measuring the right ones?

Shauna Hermel (17:38):

So how important to that transfer to the next generation is it to show the profitability of the operation. So they know that they're not just coming into a ... We will make $10,000 cash this year and not have any of the family living opportunities that we might with the job in town?

Charlotte Talbott (18:02):

Yep. I think it's crucial to make sure the operation is profitable enough and honestly has enough potential to have the next generation or to have your kids look at it as something that they want to stick around and do. Because you're right. There are a lot of jobs in town. There's a lot of opportunities that may seem easier. I think right now with the cattle market that we are in, it's potentially looking maybe a little bit more lucrative if we're going down that road. So maybe that'll be good. But I do think there's a lot of value in diversification.

So if we're thinking multiple enterprises, you talk to a lot of ranchers or producers who are saying, 'Alright, well, I've got four kids. If you're going to come back to the ranch, you've got to have a business plan.' And so maybe Kid Number One is going to be, or already is, managing the actual ranch and the cattle themselves. Kid Number Two might want to open a small feedlot. Kid Number Three might want to do some hunting. And having those diversified income streams can make the operation more resilient in the long term while also providing different opportunities that are going to fit the next generation as well as the next generation's individual interests.

Shauna Hermel (19:24):

What does a success story look like to you as someone building a sustainability plan?

Charlotte Talbott (19:31):

Number One success story to me is a operation that is going to last generations that is going to withstand risks and shocks and pressures in the system. Whether they be droughts like we've had, whether they be really volatile markets like we've also seen. And so those operations that are going to have a plan and stick to it no matter what happens and get through the other side on any potential shocks to the system is kind of the picture of sustainability for me. Obviously, there's a lot of things that go into that. Actually, my formal training was in the pasture world. I have two degrees in Animal Science, but they were both really, really pasture-focused projects for both my Bachelors and Masters. So I am a big proponent of anything pasture related. I love to go out and look at our client's pastures or go look at anyone's rangelands and help there. That's kind of your romantic picture of the ranching community that especially our consumers trust.

Shauna Hermel (20:42):

I like that. 'Romantic picture that consumers trust.'

Charlotte Talbott  (20:45):

Yep.

Shauna Hermel (20:45):

Excellent. Well, thank you. I appreciate your time.

Lynsey McAnally (20:53):

Listeners, for more information on making Angus work for you, check out the Angus Beef Bulletin and the Angus Beef Bulletin EXTRA. You can subscribe to both publications in the show notes. If you have questions or comments, let us know at abbeditorial@angus.org and we would appreciate it if you would leave us a review on Apple Podcasts and share this episode with any other profit-minded cattlemen. Thanks for listening. This has been Angus at Work!